Chris Kennedy I will not write a single unit nor a whole complex without a copy of the CC&Rs. I have seen everything from it is all covered by the master policy to "if you can't see it from outside standing on the ground it is not covered." When writing a single unit I always work it up as if the master policy doesn't cover anything. Explain that to my client and present my reasons for me preferring that they rely on the coverage I get for them and treat the master as extra on top of it.
The lengths agents will go to get their foot in the door… Client of ours, the CFO’s dad is also a P&C agent. He has been hounding his son for the business for years. The CFO is the son-in-law of the owner of the business so there’s layers of family dynamic there. In the middle of the policy term, out of nowhere, CFO calls in and advises his dad has found them a better deal on the WC and he’s moving it. Advise him on short rate penalties, potential issues with Umbrella, etc. “My dad told me there will be no penalty for cancelling early and no issues with the Umbrella.” Ultimately, family dynamic prevails, the business owner relents and says whatever, I’ll let the other guy have the WC but y’all can keep the rest of the account. Umbrella renewal coming up, we need a copy of WC policy. Other agent put them with a WC carrier that isn’t even AM Best rated, so the underwriter will pull the Employers Liability off of the umbrella unless they get back to an A or above AM Best rated carrier. Just like we told them, they did get hit with a ~$1500 short rate penalty. The cherry on top of it all, the short rate penalty for cancelling the WC midterm was more than the premium savings on the new policy. We are getting the WC back, but not without the client having to take a few licks financially. Can’t imagine lying to my own son just to get a piece of business, let alone the smallest piece of said business. The WC commission only makes up $1000/year in revenue. At the same time, I’m thankful for the sleazeball agents out there. They set the bar so low, all we have to do is show the slightest amount of integrity and care and we look amazing. Just had to share. Onwards and upwards! See less
One thing this thread highlights is that we shouldn’t automatically assume malicious intent or dishonesty. Not every agent handling commercial insurance has decades of experience, and “newer” talent doesn’t always mean they’re 18 years old or incapable. Every experienced agent in this thread had a point in their career where they didn’t yet understand umbrella carrier requirements, AM Best implications, short-rate penalties, ex-mod impact, or the downstream effects of moving WC midterm. There’s still a significant education gap in parts of this industry along with inconsistent training and oversight (especially in smaller agencies). That’s not an excuse for mistakes, but it is reality. We all pay for education somehow. Unfortunately, sometimes the client pays the tuition. The better takeaway is to keep raising the standard, mentoring newer agents, and focusing less on assumptions about intent and more on helping the industry improve.
What WC carrier charged a short-rate penalty? I haven’t seen that on any standard carriers in Colorado
In SC, I have an LLC that owns 2 commercial LRO medical offices and 5 rental townhomes. Originally wrote the townhomes with Foremost on a dwelling fire policy and the medical offices with Cincinnati on a BOP. Trying to quote an umbrella, but a commercial umbrella can’t sit above a dwelling fire policy, has to be a commercial GL policy. And their personal umbrella won’t extend - because the LLC owns commercial properties, the umbrell
Tillman
Dude, working thru like 3 of those right now. & client never understands “why can’t we just bundle it all together & save a ton of money”. Does Cincy not want the townhomes at all or do they just not want it on a BOP?
Associations Insurance Agency Inc.
It’s an aggregator, not a carrier
For as many times as I've asked no one ever gets me a copy of the bylaws. That's fine. Sure, there's a ton of stuff in the grey area. Pick something random like windows. Are they covered? Don't Know! Do I have enough coverage in place to replace them? Yes! General rule, the association is responsible for the original buildout. I'm responsible for everything else, from the paint inwards. This has born out true with claims. Even down to the pinpoint that the association drywalled and primed. HOA became a thing with apartment conversions. I once owned 1/32nd of the stairway to my unit. I paid 1/32nd of the cost to heat the room sized boiler built in 1920. The association rules meant we had our cost sharing figured out way before the bills arrived. Sure, you can get some Karens on the board. But, you vote for the board. Run against her. If she's really that bad, it will be easy to win. Now imagine if your neighbor 2 doors down starts literally running a brothel. I had a neighbor who attempted to house parolees. It was a damned lot of work to fight against. I would have loved to call up Karen the HOA vice president and ask about our bylaws.